WASHINGTON—President Barack Obama on Friday harshly criticized a proposed law in Arizona to crack down on illegal immigration and said his administration would examine the measure to see if it is consistent with federal law ...Huh? This doesn't make any sense from any perspective. If you commit a Federal crime and a state makes it a crime as well and then wants to enforce that law, the state is wrong?
It was the first time the president addressed a controversial Arizona bill that would make it a crime under state law to be in the country illegally. The bill would also require police to question people they suspect to be in the U.S. illegally about their immigration status.
My head hurts.
This one is simple KT, the law doesn't do what you say it does. It encourages profiling which, whether or not you agree with it, currently isn't legal. Its a law that will harass day laborers, but is unlikely the catch those responsible for the violence at the border. Besides, if you really want to discourage illegals working in Arizona, hold the employers criminally responsible and it will dry up over night.
ReplyDeleteWell, since the illegals are pretty much of one type, profiling is what you're going to have to do. Unless you want to try to prove that there are ust as many Swedes entering in illegally as there are Mexicans. And when you drive through the border checkpoints, aren't they profiling there?
ReplyDeleteI think what it really comes down to is the President has no intention of protecting the borders and this law calls him out on it in a big way.
ReplyDeleteAndy, it's calling a spade, a spade. I live in Arizona near the border. It doesn't matter to me why they are coming over anymore. People say, "Oh they're just coming to work and make a better life for their family". They are breaking the law of the land. In the process, they are teaching their children that it's okay to break laws. The state law allows police to enforce a federal law. Around here, the illegals are more than likely spanish-speaking latino. In some cases, not profiling is stupid.
ReplyDeleteIt's like when I pay with a credit card in the store and the cashier asks to see my ID. I don't take offense; I'm glad they asked. It is my card and I am happy they made sure it was in the right hands. Translating this to a black guy getting pulled over in a nice car, shouldn't he be glad the cops are making sure it's actually his? Or are his prejudices against the cops coming through when he's angry that he got pulled over?
Andy is, at best, misinformed.
ReplyDeleteThe law says cops can check with "probable cause."
Gee, that's the same as any other law.
Oh, and "day laborers" are generally breaking laws even if they're not illegals-- failure to file taxes, for example? Employers are already held responsible, but if you are prevented from checking (as you are in many states).....
As long as everyone is carrying their papers when the nice people from the government demand them it's ok.
ReplyDeleteI really can't see what all the fuss is about. There are a lot of countries that lock you up for not carrying your documentation on you.
A good way to know you're dealing with a world view is whan folks keep offering the same objection over and over, without apparent link to reality.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.azleg.gov/legtext/49leg/2r/bills/sb1070s.pdf
Show us. Where does it say "carry papers" in any form?
I don't trust the gov't either, but I see no poorly phrased law to bite us. It makes Federal law into state law, mostly. There's also a lot on not hiring illegals.
And by posting the actual text of the bill, Foxie makes it game, set, match. By the way, note that the entire thing, cover page included, is only 17 pages long. What were they thinking? Do you know how hard it is to hide a $10B payout to the UAW in a bill only 17 pages long?
ReplyDeleteB. FOR ANY LAWFUL CONTACT MADE BY A LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICIAL OR AGENCY
ReplyDelete21 OF THIS STATE OR A COUNTY, CITY, TOWN OR OTHER POLITICAL SUBDIVISION OF THIS
22 STATE WHERE REASONABLE SUSPICION EXISTS THAT THE PERSON IS AN ALIEN WHO IS
23 UNLAWFULLY PRESENT IN THE UNITED STATES, A REASONABLE ATTEMPT SHALL BE MADE,
24 WHEN PRACTICABLE, TO DETERMINE THE IMMIGRATION STATUS OF THE PERSON. THE
25 PERSON'S IMMIGRATION STATUS SHALL BE VERIFIED WITH THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT
26 PURSUANT TO 8 UNITED STATES CODE SECTION 1373(c).
You're quite right. You don't have to carry your papers. They'll just look you up on the computer to make sure you're supposed to be there, should they encounter you while going about their lawful business.
That makes it even better then doesn't it. Don't know what everyone is getting so worked up about.
Hmmm....Just tripped over this at one of those nasty liberal websites.
ReplyDeleteClicky
Turns out there is an option. Rather than carrying your papers round with you, you can be handcuffed, forced into a van and taken to a detention centre until your wife brings your Californian birth certificate in and shows them them your papers.
Mission creep at it's finest.
It becomes clear; they don't object to AZ's laws, they object to any laws at all.
ReplyDeleteAnd Anon, that has NOTHING to do with the new law. For starters, the new law doesn't start for quite some time, for another, the story makes it clear it happened before the bill was even signed...which you'd know if you'd gone to the primary source.
A RESPONSIBLE blogger might try to find out if it's standard to carry more than a CDL when trucking, and if so, why.
And once again, it's Foxie in a TKO.
ReplyDeleteSide note, I asked a former trucker friend-- need a CDL endorsement and an official physical.
ReplyDeleteFrom the information given, then, they had a guy who his girl thinks fits the profile of illegals, with a trucking license but not a trucking physical, who rattled off an SSN and expected that to be enough. It's NOT hard to get a false ID.
It's NOT hard to get a false ID.
ReplyDeleteSo what's the point of the law then?
Aon- false proof of citizenship is much harder to get.
ReplyDeleteNot impossible, of course. There's always full-on identity theft, rather than just stealing an SSN or driver's license number; has the advantage of not automatically tripping anything when the SSN comes back with a different name, but the disadvantage that the person whose identity you stole may object.